Post by Richie3Jack on Sept 21, 2015 14:37:23 GMT -5
Belleview at Biltmore Hotel is a Donald Ross design that was built in 1925 and was deemed a few years ago by the city of Clearwater to be a historical landmark. They did some re-design/restoration of the course back in 2001. Tampa is one of my favorite cities in the US because there is a lot of old-school, historical charm to the area and that includes the Clearwater/St. Pete area. I could be wrong, but I believe the Tampa area is the first city in Florida where a mass exodus of people from the Northeast actually moved to in order to live in Florida permanently. There was a big Italian mafia presence in Tampa in the 60's thru the 80's which was pointed out in Goodfellas as Jimmy Burke (Conway) and Henry Hill went to collect money from a gambler and threatened to throw him into the lion pit at the Tampa Zoo. But, Tampa also has a southern history and a Hispanic history to it as well and it is still entrenched in preserving that history so you get a fusion of old school New York, old fashioned southern and historic Hispanic cultures all into one combined with some modernized US City atmosphere along with the scenic view so the Bay and the Gulf.
I honestly believe that in part due to the Northeast influx of people that Tampa was one of the largest areas for money games in golf back in the day. I lived in Tampa for 3 months back in the 90's and there were plenty of money games to hit up back then whether it be at Palma Ceia, Old Memorial, Belleaire and at the MacDill AFB golf course. When I arrived to Belleview at Biltmore, I saw a bunch of guys there on a Wednesday setting up some money games there as well. I think it's good to see as I strongly feel that the lack of gambling on golf courses has hurt the game's popularity to a degree.
I had played Belleview at Biltmore back in the 90's and it wasn't in very good condition and I hardly remembered any of it. But now I had heard it was in great shape and the restoration did a fine job. Where I grew up in NY, the better courses were almost always either Robert Trent Jones or Donald Ross designs. And with that, most of the local designers patterned their designs from what they saw from Ross' designs. It's really a shame we don't see more of Ross' philosophies which were to design a course where the player would use every club in their bag at least once, smaller greens (costs less to maintain) that had some access from the front from time to time and he always made sure to make the courses walkable and with a good finishing hole. Instead, I think we see far more of a Pete Dye influence and the holes often lack a good ebb and flow to them all to set up for a beautiful signature hole that the course can show on their Web site and put on Golf Digest.
The greens were in very nice condition. The course was just very soggy, but we have received a higher than usual amount of rain since August and it's just an awful time of year for any course in the area. The roughs don't get mowed because of the rain and when they get the chance to mow the rough, the grass has grown so much in between the last time they mowed, that they end up cutting the grass too short. With that said, Belleview at Biltmore was in better condition than the GC at Eaglebrooke and far, far better condition that World Woods - Pine Barrens which I played 2 days later. I just think that this course probably doesn't drain all that well.
The course plays to 6,700 yards from the tips. I thought the course wasn't that difficult as I shot 70 (-1), but the course was so soft that it was probably keeping some tee shots in the fairway whereas if the course was rolling, some tee shots may have gotten into trouble.
The holes I liked were #2, #4, #7, #11, #16, #17 and #18.
But what I liked about the course the most was the atmosphere. There were people playing during the middle of the day on a Wednesday for money. There was a steady flow of people inside the clubhouse talking about golf. It was a nice, social atmosphere for people to meet up at which is what Mr. Ross had intended all along. And a lot of golf course designers could learn a lot and benefit from that simple concept.
3JACK
I honestly believe that in part due to the Northeast influx of people that Tampa was one of the largest areas for money games in golf back in the day. I lived in Tampa for 3 months back in the 90's and there were plenty of money games to hit up back then whether it be at Palma Ceia, Old Memorial, Belleaire and at the MacDill AFB golf course. When I arrived to Belleview at Biltmore, I saw a bunch of guys there on a Wednesday setting up some money games there as well. I think it's good to see as I strongly feel that the lack of gambling on golf courses has hurt the game's popularity to a degree.
I had played Belleview at Biltmore back in the 90's and it wasn't in very good condition and I hardly remembered any of it. But now I had heard it was in great shape and the restoration did a fine job. Where I grew up in NY, the better courses were almost always either Robert Trent Jones or Donald Ross designs. And with that, most of the local designers patterned their designs from what they saw from Ross' designs. It's really a shame we don't see more of Ross' philosophies which were to design a course where the player would use every club in their bag at least once, smaller greens (costs less to maintain) that had some access from the front from time to time and he always made sure to make the courses walkable and with a good finishing hole. Instead, I think we see far more of a Pete Dye influence and the holes often lack a good ebb and flow to them all to set up for a beautiful signature hole that the course can show on their Web site and put on Golf Digest.
The greens were in very nice condition. The course was just very soggy, but we have received a higher than usual amount of rain since August and it's just an awful time of year for any course in the area. The roughs don't get mowed because of the rain and when they get the chance to mow the rough, the grass has grown so much in between the last time they mowed, that they end up cutting the grass too short. With that said, Belleview at Biltmore was in better condition than the GC at Eaglebrooke and far, far better condition that World Woods - Pine Barrens which I played 2 days later. I just think that this course probably doesn't drain all that well.
The course plays to 6,700 yards from the tips. I thought the course wasn't that difficult as I shot 70 (-1), but the course was so soft that it was probably keeping some tee shots in the fairway whereas if the course was rolling, some tee shots may have gotten into trouble.
The holes I liked were #2, #4, #7, #11, #16, #17 and #18.
But what I liked about the course the most was the atmosphere. There were people playing during the middle of the day on a Wednesday for money. There was a steady flow of people inside the clubhouse talking about golf. It was a nice, social atmosphere for people to meet up at which is what Mr. Ross had intended all along. And a lot of golf course designers could learn a lot and benefit from that simple concept.
3JACK