Post by Richie3Jack on Feb 13, 2014 11:37:38 GMT -5
I had heard about John Daly before his victory at the PGA at Crooked Stick. He was a part-time rookie on Tour that year and was known for hitting it super long. He was hitting it on average 7 yards further than Greg Norman, #2 in driving distance. That may not seem like much, but the driving distance averages are a bit skewed and needless to say that is incredibly longer than people think.
He had also received notoriety for driving a 340 yard par-4 at a course called Endwell Greens in the Binghamton area that was straight uphill. And this was back in 1991-ish. And for all of his distance off the tee, he was doing it with a crappy Cobra Kevlar driver that had a low COR because he would routinely destroy persimmon and metal heads.
While I think Daly was the sparkplug for this bomb-n-gouge style and the courses eventually accommodating reckless bombers, it was a real fun time when he won at Crooked Stick. I watched all 4 days intently and after Thursday, the cameras were locked on Daly because he not only hit it longer than everybody else, but he did it with this super long backswing. Eventually he got paired with shorter hitting Kenny Knox and the fairways were wet which only gave John more of an advantage. You knew Knox was in for a long day when he would find the rough off the tee and Daly was bombing it 80 yards past him and was finding the fairway.
This led to all sorts of possibilities going thru golfers’ heads. I remember one reporter claiming that he should get a serious look at the Ryder Cup after the win and reasoned that if anything it would be a great intimidation factor if John could get on the range and hit one 350 yards (which seemed not humanely possible at the time) and then tell Faldo and Ballesteros ‘eh, caught that one off the toe.’
The statistics are limited for Daly in his prime. But I generally think he was probably a very effective driver off the tee. Perhaps not in the top-10, but probably hovering around top-20 to top-40, year after year. I think his wedge game was probably horrendous and he wasn’t much from the Safe Zone, but he was likely a solid Danger Zone player, consistently ranking in the top-1/4 to top-1/3 from that distance. And I think he was probably one of the worst putters on Tour. So when he putted decent and had some confidence going with his game, he could contend. Unfortunately, all of the hysteria in his life caused him to never realize his potential.
CLICK TO ENLARGE
P1 - I really like Daly's setup position. The feet are splayed nicely. No 'flat spine' and the left hand grip is fairly strong while the right hand grip is more neutral. He can't swing like he does without this setup position. If his feet were not splayed, then his hip turn becomes too restricted. If his left hand grip was not strong, then his overtaking rates would increase and he would not have the shear power he had. And if his right hand grip was strong, then he would likely have a very laid-off position at P4 with the #3 Pressure Point working under the shaft.
P2-P4: What I find so unorthodox about John's swing is not the length of the backswing. Instead, his shaft plane gets extremely flat into p3. Then as it goes to p4 it goes in the exact opposite direction and gets very upright as we can see at p4 with him being very across-the-line.
I have other swing sequences of John's where his head moves more like Hogan's did in the backswing. He moves it a bit off the ball and it lowers. Then into p4 it raises and goes back to its original location at p1. Here the head never goes back to its original location which indicates that he didn't have as much spine extension in the backswing. But, it's only a very small movement off the ball.
I also don't like his hip motion at p4 as much as I do in this sequence.
CLICK TO ENLARGE
The right hip is much higher than the left hip in this picture.
What I also find interesting is that this sequence was taken right after he won at Crooked Stick. And here the left heel stays more planted at p4. But in the sequence above the left heel is clearly off the ground. I don't have a problem with the left heel coming off the ground and wished more players did it and more coaches taught it. But, I think it shows here that John was losing some flexibility. I think it's really interesting how the left heel lift has changed the dynamics of the right versus left knee and the right versus left hip joint.
What's amazing about this swing as well as he reaches p4.5 his hips are pretty much square and his shoulders are closed, but not by a lot. He's able to do this because of his super long backswing. He has given himself 'time' to open up this much before he even reaches p5.
His shaft plane is also quite upright. But, he shallows it out tremendously thru what I see as a large pronation of the left arm. He hasn't hit p6 yet and both the hips and shoulders are open.
At impact he is well open while getting quite a bit of lateral bend. This prevents him from spinning out and hitting wipes while allowing him to pulverize the ball into orbit. The exiting of the shaft is really money...right on plane and probably meant that the path was close to 0-degrees.
Looking at this I wonder even more how truly effective John was off the tee. When we look at Bubba and his incredible effectiveness off the tee I tend to think John should have been just as effective if not more because overall I like his swing more than Bubba's. I think Bubba's is better suited for shots inside 150 yards, but I could see John being more effective from outside 150 yards. And I think because John hit it straighter he could have been more effective off the tee. But the statistics tend to point to Bubba being far superior off the tee than John.
Perhaps if John had kept himself on the straight and narrow, kept himself in shape and really work on his putting, the sky could have been the limit for him.
3JACK
He had also received notoriety for driving a 340 yard par-4 at a course called Endwell Greens in the Binghamton area that was straight uphill. And this was back in 1991-ish. And for all of his distance off the tee, he was doing it with a crappy Cobra Kevlar driver that had a low COR because he would routinely destroy persimmon and metal heads.
While I think Daly was the sparkplug for this bomb-n-gouge style and the courses eventually accommodating reckless bombers, it was a real fun time when he won at Crooked Stick. I watched all 4 days intently and after Thursday, the cameras were locked on Daly because he not only hit it longer than everybody else, but he did it with this super long backswing. Eventually he got paired with shorter hitting Kenny Knox and the fairways were wet which only gave John more of an advantage. You knew Knox was in for a long day when he would find the rough off the tee and Daly was bombing it 80 yards past him and was finding the fairway.
This led to all sorts of possibilities going thru golfers’ heads. I remember one reporter claiming that he should get a serious look at the Ryder Cup after the win and reasoned that if anything it would be a great intimidation factor if John could get on the range and hit one 350 yards (which seemed not humanely possible at the time) and then tell Faldo and Ballesteros ‘eh, caught that one off the toe.’
The statistics are limited for Daly in his prime. But I generally think he was probably a very effective driver off the tee. Perhaps not in the top-10, but probably hovering around top-20 to top-40, year after year. I think his wedge game was probably horrendous and he wasn’t much from the Safe Zone, but he was likely a solid Danger Zone player, consistently ranking in the top-1/4 to top-1/3 from that distance. And I think he was probably one of the worst putters on Tour. So when he putted decent and had some confidence going with his game, he could contend. Unfortunately, all of the hysteria in his life caused him to never realize his potential.
CLICK TO ENLARGE
P1 - I really like Daly's setup position. The feet are splayed nicely. No 'flat spine' and the left hand grip is fairly strong while the right hand grip is more neutral. He can't swing like he does without this setup position. If his feet were not splayed, then his hip turn becomes too restricted. If his left hand grip was not strong, then his overtaking rates would increase and he would not have the shear power he had. And if his right hand grip was strong, then he would likely have a very laid-off position at P4 with the #3 Pressure Point working under the shaft.
P2-P4: What I find so unorthodox about John's swing is not the length of the backswing. Instead, his shaft plane gets extremely flat into p3. Then as it goes to p4 it goes in the exact opposite direction and gets very upright as we can see at p4 with him being very across-the-line.
I have other swing sequences of John's where his head moves more like Hogan's did in the backswing. He moves it a bit off the ball and it lowers. Then into p4 it raises and goes back to its original location at p1. Here the head never goes back to its original location which indicates that he didn't have as much spine extension in the backswing. But, it's only a very small movement off the ball.
I also don't like his hip motion at p4 as much as I do in this sequence.
CLICK TO ENLARGE
The right hip is much higher than the left hip in this picture.
What I also find interesting is that this sequence was taken right after he won at Crooked Stick. And here the left heel stays more planted at p4. But in the sequence above the left heel is clearly off the ground. I don't have a problem with the left heel coming off the ground and wished more players did it and more coaches taught it. But, I think it shows here that John was losing some flexibility. I think it's really interesting how the left heel lift has changed the dynamics of the right versus left knee and the right versus left hip joint.
What's amazing about this swing as well as he reaches p4.5 his hips are pretty much square and his shoulders are closed, but not by a lot. He's able to do this because of his super long backswing. He has given himself 'time' to open up this much before he even reaches p5.
His shaft plane is also quite upright. But, he shallows it out tremendously thru what I see as a large pronation of the left arm. He hasn't hit p6 yet and both the hips and shoulders are open.
At impact he is well open while getting quite a bit of lateral bend. This prevents him from spinning out and hitting wipes while allowing him to pulverize the ball into orbit. The exiting of the shaft is really money...right on plane and probably meant that the path was close to 0-degrees.
Looking at this I wonder even more how truly effective John was off the tee. When we look at Bubba and his incredible effectiveness off the tee I tend to think John should have been just as effective if not more because overall I like his swing more than Bubba's. I think Bubba's is better suited for shots inside 150 yards, but I could see John being more effective from outside 150 yards. And I think because John hit it straighter he could have been more effective off the tee. But the statistics tend to point to Bubba being far superior off the tee than John.
Perhaps if John had kept himself on the straight and narrow, kept himself in shape and really work on his putting, the sky could have been the limit for him.
3JACK