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Post by gmbtempe on Mar 31, 2013 15:52:07 GMT -5
;D
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Post by cwdlaw223 on Mar 31, 2013 17:10:22 GMT -5
Go Cuse!
That leg break was nasty. Hopefully the kid will be alright. Good that it happened with so many medical professionals around. He's probably in surgery right now.
Adrian Peterson has screwed many an athlete coming back from his knee injuries so quickly. I think it has to take one to two years for 99.99 of all athletes to come back 100% (relatively speaking) from a devestating knee/leg injury. Derrick Rose should take his time.
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Post by gmbtempe on Mar 31, 2013 22:28:01 GMT -5
Going to be weird playing Syracuse, hardly have in my lifetime, we played twice in the late 80's when Michigan was real good and Syracuse had Coleman. The a couple years back but other then that its not a team I have any feel on.
They are long and quick and probably a matchup problem for Michigan who is more smaller but athletic at every spot. I figure Cuse has the edge unless Michigan shoots well, certainly a possibility as we have shooters.
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Post by Richie3Jack on Apr 1, 2013 8:14:14 GMT -5
I was very impressed with Mitch McGary in the Kansas game. Not only is he quite skillful, but he took a cheap shot and didn't let it get to him and really took it to Whithey.
I think he'll be a key for Michigan since a part of beating the zone calls for a big man to get the ball at the FT and either make the jumper or make a pass to an open man.
3JACK
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Post by gmbtempe on Apr 1, 2013 11:34:56 GMT -5
I was very impressed with Mitch McGary in the Kansas game. Not only is he quite skillful, but he took a cheap shot and didn't let it get to him and really took it to Whithey. I think he'll be a key for Michigan since a part of beating the zone calls for a big man to get the ball at the FT and either make the jumper or make a pass to an open man. 3JACK I would imagine they use Tim Hardaway in that spot, he has the medium range game to get it there.
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Post by Richie3Jack on Apr 1, 2013 12:23:15 GMT -5
It's usually reserved for the Power Forward or the Center because if you try and put a guard there he'll have to shoot over a 6'10" center with a 7'2" wingspan. It also takes away your guard from being out at the 3-point line and being possibly open for a 3-pointer.
There's a lot of ways to beat the zone. What Syracuse has done is alter the zone a bit along with what type of players they recruit. I think that is what has given opponents the most trouble.
In the past teams would crash the boards to take advantage of the zone's ability to defensive rebound. Boeheim has countered that with guards who can rebound and are good at picking up those bricks that carom off the rim a long ways. The same with the setting the high screen. The footwork is different and it makes it very difficult to set the high screen.
I think the way to beat the zone is to not be content on beating it one way.
There's really about 4 basic ways to beat the zone.
1. Pass to the FT line and let the player make a play.
2. guard penetrates the zone and then dishes to the outside.
3. Skip passes
4. Quick passes around the perimeter and into the FT line and then keep quick passing until the zone does not shift quickly enough.
The other problem is something that Marquette struggled with. Too often coaches demand their players take the perfectly open shot. If they don't have that perfectly open shot, then they want them to pass it.
More often than not, particularly against the zone, you just have to hit the shot. Marquette players would continually pass up a decent look because it wasn't wide open. Then they would keep passing it until there was little time on the shot clock and end up getting a worse shot off.
I think SU will be tough to beat if Michael Carter-Williams keeps playing like he does. Particularly if he keeps shooting well becasue then the guy is almost unstoppable on the college level. If MCW and Triche both play well, they'll be champions, IMO.
3JACK
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Post by gmbtempe on Apr 1, 2013 19:15:37 GMT -5
Michigan just butchered teams that zoned them this year, especially non conference, they have 3 guys with no issues making NBA 3 pointers, so like I said it comes down to a shooting contest, if Michigan shoots better and gets out in transition because Cuse shoots poorly then Michigan will win, if not, Cuse will win.
Michigan is now 20-0 on neutral or non conference games.
What I would like is to see the 4th youngest team play a year or two more together, but that's not reality anymore.
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Post by secondary on Apr 2, 2013 14:29:31 GMT -5
It has taken me this long to get to the point that I could come on here to see what was said. As a KU alum and die hard, that was brutal. My people have bemoaning E Johnson for years. After that cheap shot on McGary, we had hoped he would sit for the remainder. Throw in some bad coaching by Self at the end (why didn't they just foul Burke? 2 free throws, we win) didn't help. Burke's bombs were amazing, can't take anything away from him. Another year, another disappointment. It is nice that KU is there every year, would be better if they converted once in a while. I like Syracuse, but I really hope MI wins at this point. So it isn't all for nothing.......
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Post by cwdlaw223 on Apr 2, 2013 14:37:27 GMT -5
Hard to make shots with long arms coming at you. Syracuse's zone is different because of the size, length and speed at which the zone shifts. I hate zone play, but it works for Syracuse because they recruit players for their scheme. Not sure most college kids are patient enough to properly break down Syracuse's zone (I wouldn't be patient enough with that bullshit zone - I like run and gun, fast breaks (20 years ago unfortunately)).
Regardless of my thinking, I think three teams have a shot on any given day at this point in time. I want Syracuse or Louisville to win it (preferably Syracuse). Michigan in third. I don't want a school with their nick name the "shockers" to win it.
I love Bill Self as a coach. Kansas should have won everygame IMO. I really liked that team.
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Post by Richie3Jack on Apr 2, 2013 15:40:57 GMT -5
Syracuse's zone is unlike any other zone. I actually like the zone because we played it a lot in high school well before Syracuse started playing it. If you get an opposing player who can't be guarded, all man-to-man does is allow that player to continually beat you. With zone that eliminates that problem. It also gives you a breather because you don't have to chase around the player on offense.
When I was in high school there was a player who was recruited by Syracuse, but went to St. Joseph's named Bernard Blunt. He was averaging 40+ ppg. In the high school state finals his team won with him scoring 63 of the team's 72 points.
When we went up against him our coach said 'okay boys, we will be playing a box-and-1 against Blunt.' We looked at each other puzzingly.
The coach then said 'yes, the box will be on Blunt and we'll have Richie defend the other 4 guys.'
And no, I was hardly a shut down defender.
The other zones I see in college are not like Syracuse's. They leave too many wide open jumpers. A lot of it has to do with recruiting. Boeheim has been doing the zone since '96 and knows all of the pitfalls and what types of players to look for. A lot of the SU zone is reliant on the guards being good at avoiding high screens, the center knowing when to take the ball at the FT line or stay back to avoid the easy dump-off pass. And the guards and forwards working in harmony to set a trap.
I think what other college coaches don't undersand about SU's zone is it's really very fundamental defense. It's a move the feet properly first, use the arms and hands second. I think there's an idea that because it's zone, it's not really playing defense. But the principles are very much entrenched in the fundamentals of individual and team defense.
3JACK
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Post by cwdlaw223 on Apr 2, 2013 15:57:55 GMT -5
Go Cuse!
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Post by gmbtempe on Apr 2, 2013 18:03:36 GMT -5
Well we will show up and see what happens, you cuse fans make them sound an unbeatable squad. I have no idea how they had 6-7 losses.
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Post by gmbtempe on Apr 2, 2013 18:06:45 GMT -5
It has taken me this long to get to the point that I could come on here to see what was said. As a KU alum and die hard, that was brutal. My people have bemoaning E Johnson for years. After that cheap shot on McGary, we had hoped he would sit for the remainder. Throw in some bad coaching by Self at the end (why didn't they just foul Burke? 2 free throws, we win) didn't help. Burke's bombs were amazing, can't take anything away from him. Another year, another disappointment. It is nice that KU is there every year, would be better if they converted once in a while. I like Syracuse, but I really hope MI wins at this point. So it isn't all for nothing....... Michigan lost two brutal games like that this year, once to a half court shot by Wisconsin and then to Indiana to the end the year, games where after your like "did we just lose". If punching a guy in the balls is not an ejection offense, what is, its okay to punch him in the balls but an ejection if its his face? That was karma slapping him back, he sat with fouls the first half, got the 10 second call to really get Michigan back in it, missed the foul shot, then threw the junk pass at the end. Kansas was the better team though, no doubt (NCAA does not crown the best team, they crown a tournament winner).
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Post by cwdlaw223 on Apr 2, 2013 19:43:46 GMT -5
Well we will show up and see what happens, you cuse fans make them sound an unbeatable squad. I have no idea how they had 6-7 losses. There's one thing guaranteed about the Cuse, if they have too much talent they're guaranteed to lose. I can still remember the Richmond Spiders beating an NBA caliber Cuse team while in my dorm room in college. I was close to tears of embarasment that night. I'm anti Michigan in everything due to jealousy. ;D
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Post by Richie3Jack on Apr 3, 2013 7:48:48 GMT -5
I don't think they are unbeatable at all. Generally, MCW and CJ Fair have been very good and I think MCW is really starting to take off. Big reason why they've dominated in the tournament so far. But, if Triche and Southerland play lousy then they are in trouble. It's more like opposing fans always think that Syracuse's zone is the same as every zone out there and it's not. Other teams have tried the zone and can't make it nearly as effective as Syracuse's zone.
Personally, I've watched SU zone and it develop for the past 19 years.
We saw Indiana make the mistake of trying to push the ball and catch the zone off guard which only played right into SU's hands. And if Michigan settles for jump shots, they'll likely get beat as well.
Michigan can absolutely win the game, but it really comes down to what their defense does against the SU offense. It's unlikely that Michigan will win by beating the zone. Instead if they win it will probably be a relatively low scoring game with low FG % being made.
3JACK
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